#131526  by ChiroVette
 Fri Aug 23, 2013 5:33 pm
Hey everyone,

I am in a NYC/Long Island based Dead cover band called Unbroken Chain. Anyway, I am the Jerry guy and we have a new bass player and he is having a helluva time with the bass accompaniment to my diminished runs. I am not a bass player, but near as I can figure, Phil is on the off beat and is not playing every chord in the run that I am playing with my arpeggios. Actually, he seems to have the diminished runs themselves, but the other accompanying parts to the other arpeggios. So he has the F# dim run and he has the G# dim run.

Where he is losing it is at the following arpeggios: Em7, Bm, A, Bm, G, D, C, G, Am

I am pretty sure he is all right with the last part of that run, which is the D, C, G, Am arpeggios. But the em7 all the way through the G seems to my ear to be Phil playing some sort of an off beat, not actually hitting every chord. I can hear it but I see why he is having trouble replicating it, because I can't replicate it on the guitar or his bass.

Can anyone give any help here?
 #131531  by ChiroVette
 Fri Aug 23, 2013 6:58 pm
mkaufman wrote:I don't that those chords are right. I think it's Em7, Bm, F#m, Am, Em, Bm, Am, Em, Am.

Those may be the right Bobby chords, but those aren't the arpeggios Garcia is playing. I can create an audio file by playing the Garcia parts there which I am sure are correct. Regardless, I am more concerned with what Phil is playing there, because he is definitely not following the Jerry riffs in that segment.
 #131540  by mkaufman
 Sat Aug 24, 2013 7:14 am
Sorry, as far as the arpeggios, I respectfully disagree. Maybe he played it differently at different times? Check out the Blues for Allah recording.

I also found this which agrees with me:

Regarding the bass note: On some recordings, I hear a pattern like:

- start on B
- 3 notes of B, then 1 note up a minor third (D)
- down a full step to A
- 3 notes of A, then 1 note up a minor third (C)
- down a full step to G
- 3 notes of G, then 1 note up a minor third (Bb)
- down a full step to F
- 3 notes of F, then 1 note up a minor third (Ab)
- end on E (5th of Am)

It's somewhat syncopated as in true Lesh form, he plays 3 notes per measure, rather than 4 notes, but it's not a true triplet.

 #131542  by mkaufman
 Sat Aug 24, 2013 7:26 am
Just to clarify: we're both right as it depends on if JG plays 3 or 4 notes per descending arpeggio.

For example:

3 note arpeggio: D-B-G is a G major descending arpeggio
4 note arpeggio: D-B-G-E is Em7 descending arpeggio

Anyway, I hope I have helped with the bass part.

 #131543  by ChiroVette
 Sat Aug 24, 2013 10:26 am
Actually, Mike, you were right and I was wrong. I never really analyzed the actual arpeggios and chordal structures before in depth because I always played song from learning it years ago by ear.

What I was saying was essentially correct, musically, because D major is a substitute chord for Bm7, C Major is a substitute chord for Am7, and G Major is a substitute chord for Em7, and on all those pairs, the notes are exactly the same in each respective chord. BUT In each instance of that arpeggio series, after the diminished arpeggios, Garcia plays a note at the end of each mini-phrase that resolves NOT to the bass note of major chord but the bass note to the relative minor 7.

The reason I had the nomenclature wrong, is because I was analyzing it for the first time to try and teach my bass player the chords, and thought it would be simpler to leave off the last note in each phrase! Yes it made it simpler, BUT it also made me think it was the substitute major chord and NOT the actual relative minor 7. Honestly? Garcia may have played it differently and left off that bass note (and I think you are right, he did) but I am quite sure it wasn't intentional, and could have either been out of laziness, drugs, or just having several trillion songs in his repertoire. lol

But in any event, when I played it again, just now, not trying to teach it, and realized that my first finger kept coming to the REAL ROOT of the chord, I realized that my brain was being tricked last night by my omitting the real bass note of the arpeggio, and I was hearing major arpeggio when it really the relative minor 7 because Garcia was hitting the note at the end of each arpeggio.

Thanks for the correction!

Edit: Oh and thanks for the Phil analysis. I will get that to my bass player ASAP! :)